OCRT Forum - It strikes me that Dawkins...

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Frashavan
It strikes me that Dawkins...
Sat May 26, 2012 09:36
173.34.178.26

... is secretly worried that Christianity will die out. You can hardly position yourself as the Great Rebel Atheist, if there's no religion to rebel against.

I don't think Europe will become Islamized. The momentary efloresence of fundamentalist Islam should not blind us to the pronounced centrifugal tendencies of that religion; the multiplicity of sects that has always been its hallmark would not be diminished by bringing Europe into Dar-ul-Islam. It's very doubtful anyone who aims at a caliphate would want that...

I agree that the indifference of the UK and some other places in Europe to religion is historically limited. The trend will continue for a while but, sooner or later, as you say, some catastrophe or other will come and, in the aftermath, people may think differently.

Americans never quite understand how WWII damaged European religiosity; it's one thing to be at war, and quite another to have the Nazis dropping bomb on you nightly, or occupying Paris. And yes, it cuts the same way if the Allies are dropping bombs on you. (Yes, I am aware that Poland, which suffered more than most, didn't have the post-war drop off in religiosity, but rather the reverse. But that had more to do with having a Soviet army camped out there than anything else. I went to school with many, many Poles. I won't say I ever found them marked out by greater religiosity than any others. (Only one became a priest, no nuns that I ever heard of. The Italians got a priest, too, It was the Anglo-Irish who got most of the vocations, though: 2 priests and a brother.)

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This is not only the Atheists' dilema...... — Kasey, Sat May 26 07:11

for while many claim to have "escaped from their religious indoctrination via the application of logic and rational thinking to the doctrines and dogmas of the various sects of Christianity [in the... more
Dawkins warning? Don't make me laugh ... — Baruch, Sat May 26 07:26

hardly unexpected ... theists have been warning you uber=menschen about this possibility for decades, ever since Europe started importing Turks, Libyans, Moroccans etc. Now I see that Australia will... more
Without the French where would USA be now? (nm) — Kasey, Sat May 26 20:31

The French used us — sai ram, Sat May 26 23:52

to get to their real enemy....the English.....not because they loved democracy or us....the US went on to has perfect the technique......sai ram
Bush Jnr? an example of perfect democracy??? (nm) — Kasey, Sun May 27 17:48

Nothing perfect claimed ... — Baruch, Sun May 27 18:14

Obummer just as much as George W. Shalom
It backfired badly on France (nm) — Baruch, Sun May 27 00:45

French Army and Navy yes ... — Baruch, Sat May 26 20:58

French philosophers, not so much. Shalom
Well, Montesque is in large part... — Frashavan, Sat May 26 21:34

...responsible for your Constitution, thanks to his misunderstanding of the British Constitution. And de Tocqueville managed to give you guys several major misinterpretations of your social... more
The Celtic Americans ... — Baruch, Sun May 27 00:47

were used to being allied to France, as part of the Auld Alliance anti English. The Anglo-Americans were less comfortable working with the traditional enemy. Shalom
It strikes me that Dawkins... — Frashavan, Sat May 26 09:36
At least you recognize that Islam is not a religion! (nm) — Kasey, Sun May 27 17:50

But then neither is Christianity nor Judaism ;-) (nm) — Baruch, Mon May 28 21:51

That's ridiculous, you need to examine..... — Kasey, Fri Jun 1 08:18

what make an ideology as opposed to a religion. Any totalitarian system that involves total life control inc. what is permissible to eat >to how to function at the toilet, is way out of the realm of... more
All three Abrahamic religions are political ideologies ... — Baruch, Fri Jun 1 17:59

all three are totalitarian. Totalitarian is normal in history, the idea of limited republics is the exception. Shalom
For a comparison of fact with trivia... — Kasey, Sun May 27 07:05

have a look at Pat Condell's latest utube video on Saudi Arabia, then the accompanying respose that is featured along side of it. The thing to note in the response may be the lack of address....but... more
Well the violence is factual of course ... — Baruch, Sun May 27 08:11

the problem is in the interpretation. Is it because of religion, or politics, or Arabs being under-menschen? That is where things get sticky. Certainly I sympathize with both non-Muslim Brits who... more
The brutality you want to tag the Anglo-Saxons with.... — Kasey, Wed May 30 17:26

is equally applicable to Ghengis Kahn, Atilla, the Muslim hordes across North Africa,Spanish et al in the Americas, etc etc. human behavior by superior forces of invasion do that everywhere...even... more
True, for some we must act violent now ... — Baruch, Wed May 30 21:34

to get spoil, others of us are still feeding on the spoil provided by our grandfathers. Shalom
I am not alarmist either .... — Baruch, Sat May 26 11:48

it is unlikely that Islam will be more than influential in Europe, let alone dominant. Part of that fear is racist, like fear of Hispanics here ... the White people will gradually fail to reproduce,... more
It's not that Muslims have replaced the Jews as.... — Kasey, Sun May 27 06:59

the group the free world is after at all. The real problems is not with any peoples as such, the problem for the world's future is the indoctrinated themes of discrimination, distrust, dislike and... more
Who will build a time machine ... — Baruch, Sun May 27 07:59

Dr Who perhaps, to go back to the 5th century and prevent the invasion of Anglo-Saxons? They are still rampaging even more years than those nasty Muslims. Well yes, the Muslims haven't entirely... more
you still seem to avoid the main point being made.... — Kasey, Mon May 28 03:20

in my second paragraph as to why fundamentally the world and Islam are on a collision course dur to the indoctrinated words of the radicals and their influence via the methods now enployed by thoe... more
Have I? — Baruch, Mon May 28 05:05

You seem to be blind to all human predation, that isn't Islamic. Only that predation that matches your ideology is counted as violence. But the presence of Anglo-Saxons in Australia is pure violence... more
The numerous invasions of Britain from.... — Kasey, Wed May 30 17:18

the Romans onwards produced eventually over time variations in the national image and nature to what it is today. You, the Red Indians and our aborigines need to move on for a new beginning. History... more
I agree, history can't be changed ... — Baruch, Wed May 30 21:37

it needs to be transcended. That is one reason why Europe is in trouble, they haven't gotten past monarchies, Popes and secret Jewish bankers. Unfortunately it seems that revenge is still operative... more
Except the Germans seem to have made it.... — Kasey, Fri Jun 1 08:09

while the rest don't want to earn their way. 1912>2012 it has taken them that long to achieve their dominant economic position without going to war for it or the need for extra territory. Had... more
Yes, but could Germans be less Germanic? (nm) — Baruch, Fri Jun 1 18:00

Maybe the encirclement syndorme caused that over time! (nm) — Kasey, Sat Jun 2 03:21

Encirclement is an excuse also used by Russians (nm) — Baruch, Sat Jun 2 06:58

Surely you mean the USSR? (nm) — Kasey, Mon Jun 4 05:32

Russians by any other name would be just as paranoid (nm) — Baruch, Mon Jun 4 20:09

I am surprised... — Frashavan, Sat May 26 12:14

...that no one seems to have tried to connect Arab/Muslim oil wealth to the banks. Think of the hay that Obama/Bush could make of that... "Iran want's weapons of mass destruction, AND they own those... more
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