QuantafyreRe: You've invalidated nothingFri May 18, 2012 10:39am188.8.131.52"Furthermore, your argument that my opinion has been invalidated is an argument from silence. Not only does my inability to pinpoint the exact moment in time of my development that I chose to be heterosexual (as if you would have accepted a firm answer from me anyway) not demonstrate your point, it is a red herring intended to draw away from the actual point I was making, namely that there is a question over sexual preference but not over skin color."
"There was never any question that skin color isn't a choice. The same cannot be said about sexual orientation. BK"
***The original post drew attention to the fact that those who have been discriminated against due to skin color (something they have no control over) then discriminate against those who have undoubtedly have no control over their biologically determined sexual orientation. You then made the second statement above, suggesting that there might not be a biologically determined sexual orientation that is beyond the control of the individual; that it might be otherwise determined (which leaves choice as the only other major factor). I protested this conclusion of yours giving my opinion which is considerably more supported by the scientific evidence.
That is the essence of our debate and the source of my question to you regarding when you made your choice. I admit it is a bit rhetorical, but it was issued with the intent that I have previously elucidated.***
- One of my black friends posted this BOSS, Wed May 16 7:43pm"African American religious activists protesting against gay rights is probably the sweetest piece of irony I will experience in my lifetime." says alot right there.
- There was never any question BK, Thu May 17 8:13amthat skin color isn't a choice. The same cannot be said about sexual orientation. BK
- Quite false, of course greenman, Thu May 17 4:53pmTHere's NO evidence that humans "choose" our sexual orientation, and plenty of evidence to the contrary. Sadly, this notion of "choice" is used against gay people as if even the "choice" of... more
- You've proven my point BK, Fri May 18 6:36amThank you. The fact that people feel the need to present "evidence" either for or against orientation as a choice demonstrates there IS a question, unlike skin color. So thank you for so providing... more
- LOL greenman, Fri May 18 5:28pmNice attempt at recovery, but it's not exactly convincing. I'm sure Poppet could 'name that fallacy,' but I'll just say that there's NO evidence that suggests we "choose" our sexual orientation, and... more
- There is no fallacy BK, Fri May 18 8:08pmThere's only you proving my point. Now, you can load up on all the rhetoric you can muster to try and get around that fact, but it's plain as day to anyone with eyes. BK
- There's only you SAYING that, you mean greenman, Sun May 20 6:49pmOK, let's not call it a fallacy - let's call it "lying." We could add "pompous self-aggrandizement" to that, I suppose. Want "rhetoric?" F--- off.
- PWND BK, Mon May 21 8:37amLove it ... argumentum ad cursing. Keep up the good work, greenman! LOL. BK
- LOL greenman, Mon May 21 7:00pmIt's not an 'argumentum' at all, you pretentious twat. It's just me cursing you. You're not as smart as you think you are, are you? Not that you COULD be...;)
- You aren't very perceptive, are you? BK, Tue May 22 6:55amThe issue is never the issue with you, it's always about trying to one-up someone you disagree with. *shrug* Have fun with that. BK
- Absolutely absurd statement Brian. Quantafyre, Fri May 18 7:58am"The fact that people feel the need to present "evidence" either for or against orientation as a choice demonstrates there IS a question, unlike skin color." ANY question regarding an empirical... more
- What are you smoking? BK, Fri May 18 8:02amI'm not questioning science here - I'm simply stating that if there were no question over whether sexual orientation is a choice (that is, if it was self-evident that it either IS or is NOT), then... more
- Keep digging, man, keep digging! greenman, Fri May 18 5:30pmYOu are aware that there exist flat-earthers who insist that the Earth isn't spherical despite the FACT that it is? Or Creationists who entirely disp;ute the FACT of evolution desp;ite all the... more
- There are no examples that I can think of in the realm of Quantafyre, Fri May 18 8:30ambiopsychological conditions that are so self-evident that absolutely no counter opinions exist as to their nature. Please, if you would, give an unequivocal example.
- You're being mighty absolute there BK, Fri May 18 9:20amI realize doing so might help your position, but I'm not arguing there is nobody who, for example, believes skin color is a choice. I'm arguing that it wouldn't be reasonable to believe so. Skin... more
- Skin color is NOT a biopsychological condition.. Quantafyre, Fri May 18 9:35amBeing born with 6 fingers on one hand is also obvious of genetic determinism, but it too is not biopsychological. There is no psychological component to it.
- Agreed BK, Fri May 18 10:05amI misread what you were asking for. But now that I understand, I don't see the relevance to the discussion. The opening statement in this discussion makes an implicit analogy between sexual... more
- I'm not looking for anything. I'm saying that sexual Quantafyre, Fri May 18 10:20ampreference is not a 'choice.' I'm not saying that there is a 'gay gene;' I'm not saying that it is totally dependent on a polygenic complex within the CNS; I'm not saying that it is totally dependent ... more
- In the face BK, Fri May 18 10:37amof "what" - your opinion on the matter? Sorry if I don't find that convincing, especially when there is evidence to the contrary. Then again, I have no desire to debate this topic as it is a horse... more
- No desire to deal with what you don't approve of Christopher Blackwell , Fri May 18 7:37pmBK, Your reaction is created by your opinion. If it is something you don't approve of you don't want to hear about it. Sexis a complex subject, and many of the variations are common to a number of... more
- It is surely not dead. Research is continuing Quantafyre, Fri May 18 10:43amon the issue. Two sources underlying my opinion: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/11/071107170741.htm http://wiringthebrain.blogspot.com/2010/05/sexual-orientation-in-genes.html
- So how old were you when you decided to be hetero? (nm) Quantafyre, Fri May 18 7:49am
- I don't remember BK, Fri May 18 7:55amYou? BK
- I never had to. My genes did that for me. (nm) Quantafyre, Fri May 18 7:59am
- Oh, I see - a disingenuous question BK, Fri May 18 8:02amGot it. BK
- Nothing disingenious about it. It was asked Quantafyre, Fri May 18 8:35amto prove a point; your opinion about sexual orientation being a choice was put to a test by assuming it was correct and the implications stemming there from. You dodged the question. I answered it in ... more
- If you don't BK, Fri May 18 9:12ambelieve it is a choice for anyone, then asking me when I made the choice is a disingenuous question, no matter how you spin it. Furthermore, stating "I don't recall" isn't a dodge, it's the truth.... more
- Re: If you don't Quantafyre, Fri May 18 9:31am"believe it is a choice for anyone, then asking me when I made the choice is a disingenuous question, no matter how you spin it." ***No it is not disingenuous. I merely took your position to its... more
- You've invalidated nothing BK, Fri May 18 10:11amYou are attempting to turn this into a debate as to whether sexual preference is a choice, and have foisted the burden of proof on me when I never even made the argument that it is. Furthermore, your ... more
- Re: You've invalidated nothing Quantafyre, Fri May 18 10:39am
- True PureStevil, Thu May 17 8:42amThrough error many have assumed that orientation was volitional.
- Through error BK, Thu May 17 9:48ammany have tried to drawn an analogy that doesn't exist. BK
- But...but...but blacks don't HAVE to be black, right? Glenn, Thu May 17 4:02amI mean, MJ proved that skin color is just a choice, didn't he? >8^)
- Zing! (nm) PureStevil, Thu May 17 4:46am
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