Marianne Luban
Re: Dynasty 15
Wed Aug 15, 2018 15:23
75.169.151.187

Joe wrote:

"At that time I was trying to create enough years to place Khyan before and/or at the time of the Thera eruption (as at Knossos his cartouche is on an alabaster lid found in an archaeological layer that is dated before the eruption). Back then I accepted that it erupted around 1605, but these days I place the eruption in 1627 - see my posts on the Venus tablet, for example"
http://disc.yourwebapps.com/discussion.cgi?id=177754;article=12563

Does this mean you accept the carbon dating for the eruption? You must, as it concluded between 1627 to 1600 BCE! Well, that's good--but how old was that alabaster lid--how long before that 27 year window of time? Remember, the reign of Ahmose the Liberator has to end in 1541 BCE by the High Chronology and even Khamudi must be gone by then.


Since you mention Manetho, his idea about the Shepherds has them in Egypt for as long as 511 years. He must have seen the famous tomb of Khnumhotep II at Beni Hasan and knew the Shepherds were already around in the time of Dynasty 12 from Amenemhat II to Sesostris II, the time frame of the career of Khnumhotep. Probably, the man called "HqA XAst", whose name was Abisha, was the Salites or Saites of these Ptolemaic Era historians. After all, those who wrote in Greek always substituted "s" for "sh", which a Greek can neither say nor write. A lot of time had gone by between between the earlier part of Dynasty 12 and the final expulsion of the Shepherds--and Manetho said it was a protracted war that lasted until "Tethmosis" drove them out and he didn't mean Ahmose I. Also, Manetho specified the names he mentioned were "their first rulers", so he intended a very distant time. Even Hatshepsut claimed those same Shepherds, the Aamu [same name as in Dynasty 12] were still at Avaris down to her own time. Who knows what to trust--except that Seqenenre Tao II and Kamose fought against Apepi and Kamose probably succeeded against him. Even an Egyptian story ties Seqenenre to Apepi.

  • Re: Dynasty 15Joe Baker, Wed Aug 15 05:51
    Hi All Nothing new here about the length of the Hyksos dynasty. I raised this issue back in post 6205 on 17 May 2006 when I suggested the dynasty should have lasted at least 141+x years, see... more
    • Re: Dynasty 15 — Marianne Luban, Wed Aug 15 15:23
      • Re: Dynasty 15Marianne Luban, Fri Aug 17 09:46
        Another intriguing aspect of this is that the people of the Aegean, who were displaced by the eruption [or series of eruptions, whatever the case really was] must have had a presence in Egypt by the... more
        • re: Dynasty 15Jon Smyth, Sat Aug 18 08:44
          "In a text, the mother of Ahmose is called "the mistress of the islanders of the sea" even though she was a princess of Dynasty 17." The "islanders" in this context refer to the gezirah's in the... more
          • re: AahotepRich McQuillen, Sat Aug 18 10:44
            "In a text, the mother of Ahmose is called "the mistress of the islanders of the sea" even though she was a princess of Dynasty 17." -- I have a source for a similar statement for this from Bietak.... more
          • re: Dynasty 15Marianne Luban, Sat Aug 18 09:36
            Jon Smyth wrote: ""In a text, the mother of Ahmose is called "the mistress of the islanders of the sea" even though she was a princess of Dynasty 17." The "islanders" in this context refer to the... more
            • Wadj-wr (again)......was re: 15 Dynasty.Jon Smyth, Mon Aug 20 17:22
              Marianne Luban wrote: "We have been over this more than once and I am sure your take on this is not correct." Yes, I recall some years ago. At that time I believe I urged you to obtain a copy of... more
              • Wadj-wr for the last timeMarianne Luban, Tue Aug 21 10:06
                Jon Wrote: Marianne Luban wrote: "We have been over this more than once and I am sure your take on this is not correct." "Yes, I recall some years ago. At that time I believe I urged you to obtain a... more
                • re: wadj wrJon Smyth, Sun Sep 2 15:40
                  My apologies, I missed the last paragraph. Marianne Luban wrote: Another great philologist, Dr. Rainer Hannig, whose German language Egyptian dictionary is the one Egyptologists use [I have it right... more
                • re: wadj wrRich McQuillen, Tue Aug 21 17:57
                  "as the Nile when it flows to the sea". Glyphs: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/w%EA%9C%A3%E1%B8%8F-wr I asked my linguist friend if he had an opinion on it. He said the "wadj" is instead "Wetsi", or... more
                  • re: wadj wrMarianne Luban, Wed Aug 22 09:54
                    Rich wrote: "as the Nile when it flows to the sea". Glyphs: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/w%EA%9C%A3%E1%B8%8F-wr I asked my linguist friend if he had an opinion on it. He said the "wadj" is instead... more
                    • re: wadj wrJon Smyth, Sun Sep 2 15:31
                      Marianne Luban wrote: "wAD wr" is mostly translated as "great green" due to the greenish color of the waters of the Mediterranean. This has always been a weak argument, even the Egyptians represented ... more
            • re: Dynasty 15Marianne Luban, Sat Aug 18 09:55
              Here are some images of Minoans in Egypt. I do not, however, agree with the dates of James Thomas. https://medium.com/the-bronze-age/the-wandering-tribes-of-the-aegean-96ff9703ce3c
        • Re: Dynasty 15Robert Killian, Sat Aug 18 03:46
          Marianne, In my 'Chronicle': Ac. Shamshi-Adad 2078AM, + 33 =2111AM, OR 1792BC, 1781BC. Ac.Hammurabi 2100AM, + 42 = 2142AM, OR 1792BC, 2142AM, 1750BC. Ac. Tao II 2334AM, + 4 = 2342AM, OR 1558BC,... more
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