Jon Smyth
Wadj-wr (again)......was re: 15 Dynasty.
Mon Aug 20, 2018 17:22
174.95.172.6

Marianne Luban wrote:
"We have been over this more than once and I am sure your take on this is not correct."

Yes, I recall some years ago. At that time I believe I urged you to obtain a copy of Vandersleyen's exhaustive work on this subject, Ouadj-wr another aspect of the Valley of the Nile, 1999.
In this work he listed over 300 references to the use of that term in Egyptian texts & literature.

- We learn of an 18th Dyn text that identifies an Administration Center for Wadj-wr.

In other texts we read:
- Hippopotamus dive in the flood in the midst of Wadj-wr.
- Heliopolis is on the eastern side of Wadj-wr.
- that you can cross Wadj-wr on foot.
- Wadj-wr extends to the Hau-Nebu, in the 17th Nome of Lower Egypt.
- Wadj-wr makes the fields green for the life of the people.
- as a result of Wadj-wr, two lakes surround the Hau-Nebu, flowing into the lake of Rekhyt.
- The canal "Hen-sema-ro" brings you Wadj-wr which goes beyond the Hau-Nebu. ("Hen-sema-ro" is in the 17th Nome).
- the enemies fled to the land of the North, towards the lake the lowlands of Wadj-wr.
- I went to the kings residence – Hau-nebut who is/are on the edge of W3d-wr, in the west of Aq (canal), whose name is “Mouth of Rakotis”.
- I crossed W3d-wr.....I reached Heracleopolis.

I do recall that when we last spoke on this you claimed the reference to Cyprus (Salmania?) being in the midst of Wadj-wr was an immovable anchor for you.

Vandersleyen explains that this is not exactly what the texts says. If I recall correctly, Vandersleyen says it is a comparison with Cyprus, ie; "it is like Cyprus", not actually Cyprus. I should look it up to be precise, but suffice to say the traditional reading in his opinion was not accurate.

The above quotes & paraphrases show that Wadj-wr is within the Delta. If you recall, Ramesses III built many ships "in the midst of Wadj-wr".
Ships are built in shipyards/harbours, his harbours were in the middle of the Delta, not in the middle of the Mediterranean Sea.

Regards, Jon Smyth






  • re: Dynasty 15Marianne Luban, Sat Aug 18 09:36
    Jon Smyth wrote: ""In a text, the mother of Ahmose is called "the mistress of the islanders of the sea" even though she was a princess of Dynasty 17." The "islanders" in this context refer to the... more
    • Wadj-wr (again)......was re: 15 Dynasty. — Jon Smyth, Mon Aug 20 17:22
      • Wadj-wr for the last timeMarianne Luban, Tue Aug 21 10:06
        Jon Wrote: Marianne Luban wrote: "We have been over this more than once and I am sure your take on this is not correct." "Yes, I recall some years ago. At that time I believe I urged you to obtain a... more
        • re: wadj wrJon Smyth, Sun Sep 2 15:40
          My apologies, I missed the last paragraph. Marianne Luban wrote: Another great philologist, Dr. Rainer Hannig, whose German language Egyptian dictionary is the one Egyptologists use [I have it right... more
        • re: wadj wrRich McQuillen, Tue Aug 21 17:57
          "as the Nile when it flows to the sea". Glyphs: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/w%EA%9C%A3%E1%B8%8F-wr I asked my linguist friend if he had an opinion on it. He said the "wadj" is instead "Wetsi", or... more
          • re: wadj wrMarianne Luban, Wed Aug 22 09:54
            Rich wrote: "as the Nile when it flows to the sea". Glyphs: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/w%EA%9C%A3%E1%B8%8F-wr I asked my linguist friend if he had an opinion on it. He said the "wadj" is instead... more
            • re: wadj wrJon Smyth, Sun Sep 2 15:31
              Marianne Luban wrote: "wAD wr" is mostly translated as "great green" due to the greenish color of the waters of the Mediterranean. This has always been a weak argument, even the Egyptians represented ... more
    • re: Dynasty 15Marianne Luban, Sat Aug 18 09:55
      Here are some images of Minoans in Egypt. I do not, however, agree with the dates of James Thomas. https://medium.com/the-bronze-age/the-wandering-tribes-of-the-aegean-96ff9703ce3c
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