Marianne Luban
Re: Wine Jar Labels
Sun Jan 6, 2019 12:31
75.169.141.74

Rich McQuillen wrote:

I wrote:


"I lean most toward Smenkhkare being a son of Akhenaten now, one by a wife other than Nefertiti."

Rich:
"-- I read the paper, Bringing Smenkhkare into focus. These articles are pure gold.

So we know that Tut is the son of a brother/sister combo... whoever they may be... from the DNA."

Marianne's paper:
"Years ago, Dr. James P. Allen separated Smenkhkare, a male, from the female, neferneferuaten, both of them using the prenomen “Ankhkheperure”."

Rich:
-- So the prenomen/lastname/common parent of Smenkhkare and Nefernereruaten is Ankhkheperure. Smenkhkare and Neferneruaten were brother and sister."


They could have been--except that Neferneferuaten was most likely Nefertiti, as she used that name at Akhetaten while a queen consort. It became "Neferneferuaten Nefertiti", a long name.

Rich:
"I believe this is the brother-sister combo that were Tut's parents."


But Nefertiti was the wife of Akhenaten. Ankhkheperure Smenkhkare was a different king. Until I began to think more about Smenkhkare, I had no real picture of who he might have been. Now, as anyone who has read my paper can see, I think I have found some images of him. So it looks to me, being that he is shown with the elongated skull of a royal child at Amarna, he probably grew up there and was a son of Akhenaten--one who was born before Tutankhaten. Mainly, for at least 12 years into the reign of Akhenaten, the family of the latter with his chief queen, Nefertiti, was depicted. That, up to that time, appeared to consist only of daughters--but that doesn't mean Akhenaten had no sons by a lesser wife or wives. In fact, Tushratta of Mitanni sent wishes for the health of the sons of Akhenaten [among others] in a letter. A wife named Kiya *was* shown--but her images were changed, at some later time, to portraits of Akhenaten's eldest surviving daughters.


Kiya may or may not have been the same as Tadukhepa, a daughter of Tushratta of Mitanni. If so, that is why she may have been important enough to be shown--but another reason can have been that she was the mother of a son or sons by Akhenaten. This certainly could have been a source of humiliation to Nefertiti and, once Akhenaten was gone and Smenkhkare,too, the queen might have been the one responsible for making the images of Kiya disappear.


As I have pointed out in several of my papers, there is a sound basis for believing Akhenaten and Nefertiti to have been siblings. Alternatively, Smenkhkare could have been their younger brother.

Marianne's paper:
"for a time, a consensus began to be formed that the male remains from KV55 were those of Smenkhkare. Since some examiners assigned such a young age-at-death to the skeleton [once a mummy,] the verdict was that this was either a son of Akhenaten or his brother, raised to the kingship because the heretic had no son. Howe4er, the Present writer is convinced the bones are those of Akhenaten who was no older than around 30"

Rich:
"-- We have competing autopsy's on this mummy. One, Derry, is 20 and a new one is 30. The problem with the new one, is they ignored the old autopsy and old comments."


Each one took a fresh look at the bones--the CT scan being the most recent. This, according to the book of Hawass, "Scanning the Pharaohs", assigned a much higher date at death than ever before--but I think I know the reason for that. Since that radiologist[s] diagnosed a big problem with a femur and this usually occurs in an older individual--they decided on 40+,forgetting that the same problem can occur in a younger individual due to an injury.

Rich:
"Additionally, AM3 reigned for a long time, as did Akhenaten. 39 yeas was 17 years... almost 55 years between them. For Akhenaten to have only been 30, then Am3 would be around 36 at the time Akhennaten was born. This is old for an eldest son, and very unlikely."


Not in my opinion--and Akhenaten wasn't the eldest son. I opt for a coregency of 8 years.

Rich:
"To get to 30... I mean AM3 took power around 13 years old. If Akh did the same, he would also be 30; but with AM3 living to 52, reigning 16 years longer than average, that probably delays Akh quite a bit. If Akh assumes power at the age of 29 due to this long reign, then he died at 46 years old. So 30 is the min-age and 46 is the max-age... and I would put the expected age in the middle at 38 from Akh."


Nobody knows precisely how old either of these kings were on accession, but Amenhotep III was probably somewhere around 13 as his father was only around the age of 30 when he died. Akhenaten was around 13, also, but it's my theory he became a coregent in Year 30 of Amenhotep III, the two reigning simultaneously for 8 years.


  • Re: Wine Jar LabelsRich McQuillen, Sat Jan 5 20:02
    "I lean most toward Smenkhkare being a son of Akhenaten now, one by a wife other than Nefertiti." -- I read the paper, Bringing Smenkhkare into focus. These articles are pure gold. So we know that... more
    • Re: Wine Jar Labels — Marianne Luban, Sun Jan 6 12:31
    • re: AnkhkheperureRich McQuillen, Sat Jan 5 20:46
      In the hypothetical scenario described earlier, let's make "Ankhkheperure" a new person of royal blood. How about a prince and younger brother of AM3. In this scenario, Smenkh is neither the son of... more
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