Marianne Luban
Re: V. Spaeth and the Birth of Moses
Sun Feb 17, 2008 09:38
67.150.2.245 (XFF: 81.106.124.212)

Tory: So Moshe, born according to Spaeth in 1534, was the historical Senenmut. It seems like that is where Spaeth is headed from what little of his website I have read? There is at least one orthodox rabbi I am aware of who would agree about the identities (not the dates) and who has published his ideas on this.

ML: It could be where he's headed. I haven't read v.S.'s book but the first three chapters are available at that website. He's already made it plain, from what I can tell, that he thinks Hatshepsut must have been "pharaoh's daughter". Of course, Hatshepsut is the most famous gal of the dynasty, next to Nefertiti, but there were a lot of other "pharaoh's daughters" included in that dynasty, not quite so prominent. Funny thing, though, among the family of Thutmose I, including sons Thutmose, Amenmose and Wadjmose, there was a certain mysterious "Ramose"--at least according to J. Tyldesly. But I don't know anything about him. Also rather oddly, in that famous tomb scene called "Lords of the West", depicting defunct kings, queens and princes, there is a certain prince whose name "seems" to be Ramose and he sits there rather prettily holding a flower to his nose. What Ramose that could be nobody knows or why he was so famous as to be included in that scene.

Senenmut? I don't know how Hatshepsut could have adopted him as a child as all signs seem to point to the notion that he was older than she--depicted as aged and wrinkled on some informal portraits from around Year 7. I don't have the actual URL right now, but anyone who wants to go to my homepage

http://www.geocities.com/scribelist/marianne.html

can read about Senenmut and see portraits of him there.

Anyway, I thought I knew a lot of tidbits from rabbinical lterature, midrashim, but that one item from Rabbi Abrabanel had escaped me about what was going on in the realm of Pisces around the time Moses was born.

  • Re: V. Spaeth and the Birth of MosesTory, Sun Feb 17 06:51
    So Moshe, born according to Spaeth in 1534, was the historical Senenmut. It seems like that is where Spaeth is headed from what little of his website I have read? There is at least one orthodox rabbi ... more
    • Re: V. Spaeth and the Birth of Moses — Marianne Luban, Sun Feb 17 09:38
      • Re: V. Spaeth and the Birth of MosesMarianne Luban, Sun Feb 17 10:34
        Oh--and BTW, in my own work, "The Exodus Chronicles: Beliefs, Legends & Rumors from Antiquity Regarding the Exodus of the Jews from Egypt" [2003] I also proposed Senenmut as a candidate for... more
        • Re: V. Spaeth and the Birth of MosesMarianne Luban, Sun Feb 17 22:29
          You know, this is pretty wild. That date for the birth of Moses works out every time. The Torah says that Moses didn't return to Egypt until he was 80 "because all who had sought his life were dead". ... more
          • But, as usual--disagreement even in antiquityMarianne Luban, Tue Feb 19 06:14
            Naturally, wouldn't you know that some ancient authors, like Eusebius and Artapanus failed to believe that the Hebrews left Egypt 430 years after they had arrived--and that's one of the reasons... more
            • But, as usual -- disagreement in antiquityCullom, Tue Feb 19 19:50
              Hello Marianne, Your comments are very interesting and informative. I think the church historians engaged in a bit of historical revision for political as well as religious reasons. It might have... more
              • Re: But, as usual -- disagreement in antiquityMarianne Luban, Tue Feb 19 23:55
                Cullom: I think the church historians engaged in a bit of historical revision for political as well as religious reasons. It might have seemed preferrable to have Moses and God best a famous king of... more
                • But, as usual -- disagreement in antiquityCullom, Wed Feb 20 18:23
                  Hello Marianne, Do you know of any king besides Ahmose and Amenhotep I during the period in question who was succeeded by a son-in-law? I suppose Thutmosis II was succeeded by a son-in-law since his... more
                  • Re: But, as usual -- disagreement in antiquityAnonymous, Fri Feb 22 02:02
                    Cullom: Do you know of any king besides Ahmose and Amenhotep I during the period in question who was succeeded by a son-in-law? ML: Nope. And Ahmose was succeeded by a son. Cullom: I suppose... more
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