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Vince Garcia
Re: Try leaving out the white guys.
Thu Apr 5, 2018 7:33pm
2001:558:6012:3e:9d4d:deba:2336:d11a

Excellent comments. We have the same problem in trying to translate some fine points in Biblical texts.

This has led me to wonder if you can comment on the point Christ brought up about the word "ugly"

Can that passage mean something else? Perhaps something like "somewhat damaged" to reflect damage to the head from the wound?

  • Re: Try leaving out the white guys.Daniel Buck, Thu Apr 5 10:04am
    Pat, The Expediente was compiled November 1908 to March 1909 by the Tupiza district attorney. That's the original, the document we are working off of, the one I am quoting from. There is no mention... more
    • Re: Try leaving out the white guys. — Vince Garcia, Thu Apr 5 7:33pm
      • lost & found in translationDaniel Buck, Fri Apr 6 6:07am
        Vince, biblical translations have fueled disputes for hundreds of years, and will for hundreds more. Of course, in that case we trying to understand the word of God (supposedly.) Here we're trying... more
        • Re: lost & found in translationVince Garcia, Fri Apr 6 7:18pm
          Again, good reasoning. And I definitely understand the issue w/regional dialects. (There were like 30 regional dialects of Aramaic so when someone asks a question like, "How would that translate from ... more
          • Re: lost & found in translationDaniel Buck, Sat Apr 7 5:24am
            Vince, there are three later photos, two from Argentina, ca. 1904, and one from Bolivia, ca. 1908, but the resolution is not great. In the Bolivia photo SK looks like he has thickened around the... more
            • Re: lost & found in translationVince Garcia, Sat Apr 7 9:08am
              After I wrote that, I recalled the camp photo which we have talked about before, and which I have remarked--since we're talking about who DOESN'T look like Butch and SD--doesn't look look like them.... more
              • Re: lost & found in translationDaniel Buck, Sat Apr 7 10:01am
                Vince, The camp photo? Do you mean the 1908 photo from Bolivia? Yes, the resolution is not great, and it's not a close up, but the pair are dressed in Montana Peak hats, light shirts, vests, etc., as ... more
                • Re: lost & found in translationVince Garcia, Sat Apr 7 10:08am
                  Yes but my main point is that if I just brought the photo to you and said "This is a photo of Butch and SD" I dont think you would agree just based on a visual examination of the two. i.e., it don't... more
            • BallparkChrisV, Sat Apr 7 6:29am
              The description of the corpses is no where near "in the ballpark" Its not them. Lets regroup and find out what really happened.
        • Re: lost & found in translationChrisV, Fri Apr 6 6:23am
          Dan, I dont normally rate guys, but I think that both Sundance and Butch were both in the category of handsome guys. To judge one a little uglier, to me doesn't make sense if it were the outlaws. You ... more
          • Re: lost & found in translationDaniel Buck, Fri Apr 6 6:41am
            Chris, it's more important what Remigio Sánchez thought. That said, I don't think it's unreasonable, based on the few photographs we have, to describe Sundance as "bien parecido" and Cassidy as "un... more
            • Re: lost & found in translationChrisV, Fri Apr 6 6:58am
              Dan, Actually, its more important to look at the description of the two corpses. If you zoom in on the fw5 photo, you can see his Butch's scar. It must have been quite noticeable. You would think if... more
              • Re: lost & found in translationDaniel Buck, Fri Apr 6 12:38pm
                Chris, The mention of a scar on Cassidy's face is from his Wyoming prison record, 1894: "has a small red scar under the left eye." It might have been the result of the pistol-whipping sheriff Bob... more
                • Re: lost & found in translationChrisV, Fri Apr 6 1:18pm
                  The unique scar was there in the FW5 1900 photo and in the 1901 RR photo. Would have been there if Butch was the right corpse. He wasnt. It was an ugly, short , upturned nose, guero. And a stupid one ... more
      • VincePat, Fri Apr 6 6:06am
        Christ wasn't white and blond either or hanked a pug nose.
        • Re: VinceVince Garcia, Fri Apr 6 8:01pm
          You were there and saw what He looked like? Other than supposing He looked something like the guy on the Shroud of Turin, I have mo idea what Jesus looked like or what color His hair or complexion... more
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