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koppenhaverd
Grammar questions
Mon Oct 19, 2015 14:31
152.10.142.155

Amanda, why do you think kids need to know parts of speech? The connection to writing sentences is not clear to me.

Re: grammar instruction. We have known for over 50 years that explicit grammar instruction is ineffective as a means of improving children's writing. We didn't know until 1984 and Hillocks' meta-analysis and then again in 2007 with Graham and Perin's meta-analysis and then yet again in 2012 with Graham et al's meta-analysis that it actually has a negative correlation with writing quality (i.e., that it makes kids worse writers). However, grammar instruction, like worksheets and spelling tests, have such enormous traction that research seems ineffective in convincing school systems and intrusive legislatures like our own that we should approach the problems differently.

No one argues that kids shouldn't learn to write conventionally so that they can communicate clearly. The 12 strategies you are exploring from Graham et al (2012) this week are some of the better ways. So are sentence-combining and use of inquiry.

  • grammar - amanda grindstaff, Mon Oct 19 06:50
    After reading the three articles, I would like to say I wish they had told our sixth grade teacher not to make us diagram sentences. Just kidding. I do not teach grammar explicitly because I teach... more
    • Grammar questions - koppenhaverd, Mon Oct 19 14:31
      • Grammar - Amanda grindstaff, Mon Oct 19 14:50
        To be honest I guess it's partly more because I feel like it will be lost if we don't pass it along. I don't feel like it needs to be taught outside and in and of itself. And I agree it's useless... more
        • spelling - candithompson, Fri Oct 23 13:56
          Amanda, I have thought about spelling test for a while now. Parents always ask me first thing about spelling test and when will I send their words home. Do you think it is the fact that most parents... more
          • Spelling - Amanda grindstaff, Sat Oct 24 00:23
            Candi, I honestly think after doing this a while that spelling is the one thing most parents are familiar with and can help their kids do because it hasn't changed much over the years. They know how... more
            • Re: Spelling - candithompson, Wed Oct 28 16:13
              Thanks! I find it interesting how much parents want spelling homework and tests. It is one of the few things that has not changed in school today. I now see how they feel helpful and needed at this.
        • Don't want it to be lost - koppenhaverd, Mon Oct 19 16:07
          So essentially your argument is "if it was bad enough for me, it's bad enough for my kids" :-) You're a bright, creative, thoughtful teacher and mother. I bet you can find something more useful to... more
          • grammar - amanda grindstaff, Mon Oct 19 16:19
            I truly feel like teaching grammar is a waste of time and I do feel like it is more important to teach them how to plan, draft, revise, edit and publish and to be more creative and in time the other... more
        • writing/grammar/handwriting - amanda grindstaff, Mon Oct 19 15:15
          And further more...I do see how when a student is worried about being a perfectionist when they can go back and fix everything - I can see how that would take away from the creativity, but I just... more
          • Forget grammar; love writing - Melanie McLeod, Thu Oct 22 20:16
            Hi, Amanda: I have always felt as if I "was doing wrong" by not explicitly teaching the weekly grammar skill to my students. However, especially since I have moved to a primary-grade classroom and... more
            • Forget Grammar - shannonsilver, Mon Oct 26 22:28
              So never mind on the grammar books, right! I know that there is "grammar" in the listening/speaking goals in CCSS but that doesn't mean that we have to explicitly teach grammar. I'm so glad that you... more
              • DOL Practice - Melanie McLeod, Tue Oct 27 05:52
                Hey Shannon: If I do not have time within my school day to use DOL activities, I am not going to do so. However, if I need a 'time filler' within the school day, I believe it would not hurt the... more
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