Gary Roberts
How?
Sat Apr 21, 2012 08:09
Chris, How does one select without knowing the content? I've not learned the magic of selection. I want it all first. Then, and only then, can I truly decide what is relevant. I sometimes miss something, its true, and there are things that haven't been discovered yet, but I want selection to be informed.
- Crawley Dake — harveycmd, Wed Apr 18 16:19Does anyone know of reliable evidence and/or accounts of Crawley Dake’s possible knowledge and support of the vendetta ride? Best, Chris
- Dake — Butch Badon, Fri Apr 20 12:41Crawley allegedly funded Wyatt's vendetta ride. There's no doubt he (Dake) knew of the ride. Whether he knew details beforehand is anyone's guess. Dake was a political animal of the worst sort. He... more
- Re: Dake — harveycmd, Fri Apr 20 14:11I'm looking for documentary evidence concerning Dake's knowledge of the vendetta ride. I would assume he had general knowledge of Wyatt's plans, but I am wondering if there is more connecting Dake to ... more
- Yes — Butch Badon, Fri Apr 20 16:14Right now I am in the process of packing all of our household belongings for an upcoming move to Jonesboro, Ark., so the evidence I am referring to is packed away in a box. However, it is well-known... more
- Leigh Chambers — bfrey, Sun Apr 29 13:44Was a special Federal investigator that looked into Dake's accounts. Dake at one time had purchased land with 22 thousand in cash. In some accounts it says Dake blamed Earp for embezzling funds and... more
- Re: Yes — harveycmd, Fri Apr 20 16:48Butch, Thanks. I remember seeing reference to this report in Gary’s book. As best I can tell, not having seen the report itself, this indicates that Dake was channeling funds to Wyatt through Wells... more
- For what its worth from newspapers... — K.t.K., Fri Apr 20 15:46Basically chronologicl: "It is reliably stated that United States Marshal Dake will place in the hands of proper authorities a sufficient amount of funds for the organization and equipping of a body... more
- oops, left one out. — K.t.K., Fri Apr 20 15:49"Wyatt and Morgan Earp, Doc Holliday, 'Texas Jack," - Smith, McMasters, and one or two others left the city yesterday afternoon for- where, no one apparently knows, but when in the vicinity of... more
- Kenny, one more. — Bob Paul, Fri Apr 20 20:00Kenny: Good summary (as usual), please allow me to suggest one more---an interesting perspective in the Arizona Republican edition of March 3, 1898, by some guy named R.H. Paul. He is writing from... more
- Thanks Bob. But easy with the word "obtuse." — K.t.K., Fri Apr 20 20:35That word freightens me from "The Shawshank Redemption." It ccould get you 30 days in the "hole!" Kenny
- Chris — Gary Roberts, Sat Apr 21 05:31There is ample evidence of Dake's involvement with the Earps (or his use of them for his purposes, depending on one's perspective) in the National Archives records of the Justice Department (both the ... more
- Re: Chris — harveycmd, Sat Apr 21 06:23Gary, Thanks. I will try to check out the Ball sources. My long experience with books with phrases like “racial division” in the title makes me wary, so I will stay away from that one. I am looking... more
- It proved costly — Gary Roberts, Sat Apr 21 06:52but Dake never turned his back on the Earps. On December 8, 1881, after the Spicer hearing, he spoke of the "effectual blow" his deputies had struck, and he made his position clear: "hereafer my... more
- Re: It proved costly — harveycmd, Sat Apr 21 07:18Gary, Yes, costly. In addition to the embezzlement charge, I have read that Dake was forced out as US Marshal of Arizona Territory because of his not so clandestine support of the Earps. In the... more
- I don't think so — Butch Badon, Sun Apr 22 11:38with regard to Chalmers performing a lackluster investigation to satisfy politicos. When Chalmers filed an initial report, his boss was not satisfied and chastised Chalmers for what appeared to be... more
- Re: I don't think so — harveycmd, Sun Apr 22 12:04Butch, Perhaps Chalmers’s boss thought it did not look good enough to satisfy whomever it was supposed to, so he told Chalmers to dig some more. Did Chalmers find conclusive proof that Dake embezzled ... more
- Well — Butch Badon, Mon Apr 23 16:23as I recall Chalmers' second report was much more thorough and provided enough evidence to put Dake through a tough civil trial. In other words, the federal government took him to court over the... more
- Re: Well — harveycmd, Mon Apr 23 16:56Butch, Perhaps. But absent evidence to verify Dake’s connections worked to get him off with a wrist slap, we are simply one step further removed and therefore no closer to saying what happened. Mind, ... more
- Well, Butch and Chris — Gary Roberts, Tue Apr 24 06:55I've not made a detailed examination of Dake's accounts, but I do find his situation and his response to it interesting. U. S. Marshals were given advanced funds, up to $20,000 at a time, and they... more
- Seems to me — Butch Badon, Tue Apr 24 11:12that I recall that Dake was criticized his Chalmers' report when he said he was unable to get vouchers from Wyatt Earp and others. Dake said he couldn't find Earp. Yet Chalmers' reported that Earp... more
- The rest of the story — Gary Roberts, Wed Apr 25 06:55Butch, I'm not trying to give Dake a pass, merely suggesting the story is more complicated than commonly assumed. Larry Ball's "Pioneer Lawman: Crawley P. Dake and Law Enforcement on the Southwestern ... more
- Re: The rest of the story — harveycmd, Thu Apr 26 04:53Gary, Is the information in Ball's article on Dake in THE JOURNAL OF ARIZONA HISTORY contained in his book on US Marshals of New Mexico and Arizona? Best, Chris
- Some, not all — Gary Roberts, Thu Apr 26 05:20The emphasis is a little different.
- Re: Some, not all — harveycmd, Thu Apr 26 07:19How has the emphasis changed?
- Much is the same — Gary Roberts, Fri Apr 27 11:55but the article seems a little more personal. The book is focused on the office of the U. S. Marshal in Arizona and New Mexico. Actually, Ball seems more critical of Dake in the book than in the... more
- Re: Well, Butch and Chris — harveycmd, Tue Apr 24 09:10Gary, Thanks for the thoughtful run-down. Your agreement that proving Dake was criminally embezzling is well noted. As I previously mentioned, and as you also discussed, the political climate... more
- Re: Well, Butch and Chris — harveycmd, Tue Apr 24 12:29Second sentence should read: "Your agreement that proving Dake was guilty of criminally embezzling would be difficult is well noted."
- Addendum — Gary Roberts, Sat Apr 21 07:14Not checking BORDERLINE AMERICANS won't hurt you much on the specific question you pose. Benton-Cohen's focus is not Dake or the Earps, but as a principle of research I would caution you to dismiss... more
- Re: Addendum — harveycmd, Sat Apr 21 07:27Gary, Selection is part of the process. Again, my experience with these things is wide and varied. Titles of studies published by academic presses are only slightly less geared toward target... more
- How? — Gary Roberts, Sat Apr 21 08:09
- Re: How? — harveycmd, Sat Apr 21 10:01Gary, How? By examining the marketing attached to the content. For example, if one looks at two titles for studies in political theory and one is titled something like POSTCOLONIAL PERSPECTIVES ON... more
- General outlook — Gary Roberts, Sat Apr 21 12:21I understand the impulse, but I find it surprisingly anti-intellectual for one committed to reason. I was trained to consider all points of view. When I studied the causes of the American Revolution... more
- Re: General outlook — harveycmd, Sat Apr 21 13:41Gary, My primary goal is to learn too. With that purpose in mind, I have found that I must be selective in choosing sources. I read quite a bit, but I don’t have an unlimited amount of time or... more
