Tory Thorpe
Re: Pip is not Nb
Fri Jun 1, 2012 10:34 (XFF:

Hi Marc

You wrote: For cuneiform Nip- as indisputable and viable alternative way to transcribe Egyptian nfr...

You will not find me in disagreement with this in any of my remarks on this or other threads. Helck also agrees with you; cf. W. Helck, Ägyptologische Bemerkungen zu dem Artikel von J. Freu in “Hethitica XI 39”, Hethitica 12 [1994], p. 19).

You wrote: In the same way, Ni-ip-ḫu-ur-ri-ia of EA 9,1 is necessarilly Akhenaten simply because Tell el Amarna was abandonned AS ROYAL PALACE (even the city was still inhabited) during year III of the queen pharaoh...

EA 9 (from Babylonia) has Ni-ib-ḫu-ur-ri-ia not Ni-ip-ḫu-ur-ri-ia. It was the Hittite scribes who wrote Ni-ip-ḫu-ur-ri-ia-aš and also Pi-ip-ḫu-ur-ri-ia-aš. I apologize in advance if this correction will be perceived overly pedantic but the distinct spellings are there and should not be confused.

Ni-ib-ḫu-ur-ri-ia is an acceptable transliteration of Tutankhamun's prenomen. Now, I'm not saying EA 9 must be addressed to him. I am saying Ni-ib-ḫu-ur-ri-ia is absolutely one way his name would be written, because Egyptian /nb/ becomes NIB, NIM, IM, and even MIM in Akkadian. The fact that there are zero examples of Egyptian /nfr/ being transliterated by Akkadian NIB speaks strongly against EA 9 being addressed to Akhenaten.

Regards Tory

  • Re: Pip is not NbMarc Gabolde, Fri Jun 1 08:35
    Hi Tory, Just few words for the discussion about Pip/Nip/Nib/Nap which I posted today in another discussion on ANECF concerning the king Nephersôphris known from the Suidas Byzantine Encyclopaedia.... more
    • Re: Pip is not Nb — Tory Thorpe, Fri Jun 1 10:34
      • Niphururiria againMarc Gabolde, Fri Jun 1 16:54
        Dear Tory, Jared MILLER, Hittitologist, in his « Amarna Age Chronology and the Identity of Nibḫururiya in the Light of a Newly Reconstructed Hittite Text », Altorientalische Forschungen 34... more
        • Re: Niphururiria againTory Thorpe, Fri Jun 1 17:04
          Dear Marc I would still want to see the Akkadian text of EA 9. NIP and NIB are not written exactly the same way in Akkadian cuneiform. That is not true. Miller is probably making small errors here.... more
          • EA 9, 1Marc Gabolde, Sat Jun 2 06:16
            Dear Tory, I must add that the index of Bezold & Budge, p. 154, gives : Ni-ip-ḫu-ur-ri-ri-ya for the royal name on tablet Bezold & Budge n° 2, 1 (EA 9, 1). Regards
            • Re: EA 9, 1Tory Thorpe, Sat Jun 2 09:52
              Hi Marc Thank you for these links. I must say, is a wonderful online resource. I'm now searching it for A. Ungnad's article "Eponymen" in RlA 2 (1938) but it does not seem that... more
              • EA 9Marc Gabolde, Sat Jun 2 10:23
                Thanks Tory for explainations. So Nip- or Nib- ? for EA 9. As you may suspect, I disagree concerning your identification of Niphururia. Regards Marc
          • EA 9Marc Gabolde, Sat Jun 2 06:00
            Hi Tory, Two links that may help: Photos of EA 9 (BM 29785) at :... more
      • NiphururiiaMarc Gabolde, Fri Jun 1 11:44
        Dear Tory, Only few books available on my desk, however, concerning EA 9,1 : Moran gives NiBḫurrereya, but Knudtzon I, p. 88, gives ni-ip-ḫu-ur-ri-ri-ia, R.S. Hess, Amarna Personal Names, ... more
        • Re: NiphururiiaTory Thorpe, Fri Jun 1 16:39
          Dear Marc Well it cannot be both NIB and NIP in EA 9, so I would very much like to know who is telling the truth. I would know who if I had access to the cuneiform text. Maybe someone does and can... more
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