Fred
Re: Some notes on Shebitqu
Fri Jun 27, 2003 08:43
81.51.159.103 (XFF: 202.148.93.91)

Dear Ian,

Some quick comments

1. Can you comment on your particular reasons for abandoning the synchronism Shabaqo-Bakenranef, which you defended in the past.

FP : the traditionnal synchronism comes from an overinterpretation of Vercoutter, shown by Ibrahim Aly in his thesis on Serapeum, and sustained in personnal communication by Perdu and Devauchelle who have worked on these data some years ago with Aly.

4. This is the exact inverse of your comment about the HPA Haremakhet. We do not know when he started his high priesthood and perhaps he was not installed by his father Shabaqo but my a later king--just like several Divine Adoratrixes were installed by their brothers.

FP : You make big errors here : no adoratrix was ever installed by her brother. All known case are by fathers, and there is in fact only one not-known case : Amenirdis I, with the regularity of father-installation, it is obvious that Kashta installed her. For Hormakhis, no information comes certainly, but I wonder why Taharqa has installed him as HP, whereas he installed his own son Nesyshutefnut only as 2nd PA. Evidently Taharqa was not able to install him as HP because Hormakhis was yet here.

The only reason to make Shabataka the direct predecessor of Taharqa are the kawa stela. I think nonetheless that this data can be interpreted in another manner if we admit the other order that fits more with Near-Eastern data

Best,

Frederic

  • Re: Some notes on ShebitquIan, Thu Jun 26 21:06
    Dear Fred, I think the possibility exists, but it is very very slim. There are still a number of points that trouble me. 1. Can you comment on your particular reasons for abandoning the synchronism... more
    • Re: Some notes on Shebitqu — Fred, Fri Jun 27 08:43
      • Re: Some notes on ShebitquIan, Fri Jun 27 09:32
        Dear Fred, 1. On the Bakenranef - Shabaqo synchronism. I am familiar with the arguments against it, but I am still willing to accept the conclusion that we have a Year 6 - Year 2 synchronism. The... more
        • Re: Some notes on ShebitquFred, Sat Jun 28 05:07
          Dear ian, some errors...: Ian : We have no idea who nominated Amenirdis I, but we do know that she became the God's Wife of Amun (as opposed to the apprentice) in the reign of her brother Shabaqo. We ... more
          • Re: Some notes on ShebitquIan, Sat Jun 28 08:38
            Dear Fred, 1. According to Morkot, Shepenwepet I died probably between Year 12 and Year 15 of Shabaqo. Hence Amenirdis I became God's Wife in that reign. 2. Shepenwepet I is depicted in the inner... more
            • Shabaqo-Shebitqo againIan, Sun Jun 29 22:42
              I recently came across a point that does not seem to have been covered by our recent discussion of whether or not to invert the traditional order of Shabaqo and Shebitqo within the 25th Dynasty. I am ... more
              • Re: Shabaqo-Shebitqo againAnonymous, Mon Jun 30 16:02
                Hi Ian! I tried to write to you earlier, but your server appears to systematically refuse anything I send to it. Anyway, I've asked Leo to forward the message (about JEA 88 and a very short PS on... more
                • Re: Shabaqo-Shebitqo againJoe Baker, Wed Jul 2 07:34
                  Hi all Well-ll-ll, so Fred is investigating a reversal of Shabaka/Shabataka and seems to be quite enthusiastic about it (he has announced it here and on the NC list). And using many of the arguments... more
                  • Re: Shabaqo-Shebitqo againChris, Wed Jul 2 19:26
                    I have just received a copy of an interesting article by Stephanie Dalley, "Yaba, Atalya and the Foreign Policy of Late Assyrian Kings", SAAB 12:2 (1998) 83-98. Its central argument is that these two ... more
                    • Re: Shabaqo-Shebitqo againIan, Wed Jul 2 22:31
                      Dear Chris, Shoshenq (Shu-sa-an-qu) was the son-in-law or brother-in-law (hatna sharri) of Sin-ahhe-eriba, but almost certainly in Nineveh, rather than Egypt. He stood as witness to a real estate... more
                  • Re: Shabaqo-Shebitqo. Try it again JoeJoe Baker, Wed Jul 2 07:40
                    Hi all Well-ll-ll, so Fred is investigating a reversal of Shabaka/Shabataka and seems to be quite enthusiastic about it (he has announced it here and on the NC list). And using many of the arguments... more
                    • Re: Shabaqo-Shebitqo and RudamunJoe Baker, Wed Jul 2 07:52
                      Hi all 1. AFAIK the only objection to my genealogy is that Shepenupet 2 is not the sister of Shabaka. I understand there is an inscription stating this, but does it use a generic term to describe the ... more
                • Re: Shabaqo-Shebitqo againIan, Mon Jun 30 20:04
                  Hi Jean-Fred, Try my imladjov@yahoo.com address for future correspondence, I do not know why umich does not like your server. You wrote: "The group of stelae from some year 4 (Shoshenq V according to ... more
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